More on the 14th Amendment-Take three

On Jan 27, 2015, at 6:09 AM, Arnie Rosner <> wrote:

Hello Tom,

Its me…the messenger.  The messenger of the creator.  He keeps trying to tell us something.

As you may recall our last exchange…it boiled down to your insisting I provide a solution.  That is very interesting Tom.  Very interesting indeed.

My obligation is to report the crime of which I became aware; not provide the solution.  Now that you too are aware of this crime…are you telling me you are choosing to ignore it?

Really Tom?

A crime of such magnitude that it has adversely affected every American, since the inception of this fraud and you really intend to ignore it?  A crime of such broad implications it affects even the matter of immigration and amnesty?

That does say a lot about who you really are doesn’t it?

Well Tom, as I mentioned you certainly are a lot smarter than me.  You are also well educated, so from the position of your superior intelligence and education, as promised I accepted your challenge and here is a response from Judge Anna von Reitz of Alaska.

By the way, you may also be interested in this notice published in Alaska, by a group with whom the judge is associated.  This issue is indirectly related to this same matter of fraud on the American people based on the unlawful legislation which is still being imposed by the fraud of the 14th Amendment.

On Jan 12, 2015, at 10:56 AM, Anna von Reitz wrote:

For all Tom’s academic credentials it is apparent that he still needs to learn how to think.  That is one of the unfortunate results of education these days— a whole generation equipped with methods, but no means, and protocols without meaning at the end of all the processing.

What IS the “US government” Tom asks, as if the existence of a governmental services corporation doing various government functions was the mystery we are supposedly overlooking or failing to explain?  Someone has to sweep the streets and run the jails.  Those people are called “public employees” and we have mistakenly assumed that the employees of government ARE the government.

They are not the government.  We, the People, are the government.  It is vested in each and every one of us and nowhere and in nothing else.

This is a radical concept quite foreign to Tom’s assumptions, so it may be difficult for him to conceptualize the fact that the collection of buildings and functions and people running to and fro are NOT the government.

You may recall Arnie that early on you jumped to the conclusion that there was no valid US government?  Tom appears to be making the opposite mistake and assuming that because there are existing government services and government employees that they are the government.

Which implies that we are NOT the government and that because our ancestors delegated certain responsibilities to government employees that we no longer have the ability to control and direct the modern day employees?

Time for Tom and others to think again.  That THING in Washington, DC is NOT our government.  It is a run amok and misguided manifestation of agreements made long ago which have been misinterpreted, left unenforced, and defaulted upon— nothing more or less.

It is up to us to either enforce the contract or negotiate a new one or find new partners or develop means to more directly provide public services and husband public resources.

Over 200 years have passed.  We no longer need to run the government entirely by deputizing individuals  or allowing them to “represent” us.  With today’s technology we can each have a much larger and more direct role in running OUR government.  For example, why should each one of us NOT be able to decide what portion of the budget to spend on defense?  Education? Welfare? New infrastructure?   We don’t need to be members of Congress to have informed opinions about our priorities as people.  We are perfectly able to as a group determine allocation of resources within general categories and so direct the Big Picture of where the priorities are focused.

Tom also seems to be saying, or maybe the better word is “taunting” you in behalf of the government employees— saying, “We’re King of the Mountain!  We’re King of the Mountain!”—– you’ve worked and complained and where has it gotten you, Arnie Rosner, nyah-nyah-nyah-nyah-Nyah!

This is a pathetic response from a supposedly educated man.  Educated men are able to discern more than playground realities.  They are also aware of basic mathematics.  There are a few million government employees, but there are hundreds of millions of the rest of us and at the end of the day, all those government employees are utterly dependent on us.  We hold the ultimate purse-strings upon which they depend, because in the end we own the resources and assets.  We have merely allowed them to manage those resources and assets.  They’ve done a bad job of it.  They’ve defaulted on their contract.  It is only a matter of time before these facts come home to roost and they are no longer “King of the Mountain”.   Water flows downhill— a fact that Tom needs to recall.

Over time people have come to believe in the “power” vested in the US Government as some externalized megalithic power.  It’s not.  It’s our own power misguided, and to the extent it is misguided, it is extremely vulnerable both to criticism and to destruction.  I say this in a positive way, as destruction of what is in error is a good and necessary process.

Just as you once thought that no government existed and as Tom thinks it exists but mistakes it for something other than what it is, correction is possible.  You woke up and realized that the power is in fact vested in you and Tom can wake up and realize that the power is vested in him.  You both externalized the power in other people and in institutions and service organizations— just made different assumptions about the externalization of “government”.

What is the US Government?  It is whatever we require it to be, according to our will and desire and requirement.  It is the exact reflection of how we decide to do business, what we believe to be right and wrong, and what we will tolerate.  Tom needs to review the “straw poll” represented by the most recent elections to get a better grasp of what this means.  Americans sent a clear message to Washington about what they will tolerate and their will to make changes.  Washington can either hear the roar or continue to stuff its head in the sand and offer the false choices (talk about false premises!) between chocolate flavored shit and vanilla flavored feces.  If it continues on the road it is on, the tolerance level of the People will be reached and sweeping changes will come whether Washington likes it or not.  THAT is the reality.  The real power stays with the Arnie Rosners—the adults with their feet firmly on the ground and an equally firm grasp on reality own the “Mountain” and they are entirely capable of exercising their power in effective ways.

On Jan 12, 2015, at 1:20 AM, Arnie Rosner wrote:


Thank you for your analysis.  With your sophisticated level of credentials and superior intellectual knowledge, who could argue your point better than you?    OK…I concede I am out gunned.

To help even out the odds, and bolster my inadequacies, I am also taking the liberty of adding Judge Anna Von Reitz, of Alaska.  Judge Anna has been very kind and gracious in providing valuable insight into answering the type of question you raised as to how to resolve this mess.

There is no guarantee she will respond, but at the same time, she may take a few moments to grace our exchange and interject some critical wisdom that transcends my earthly capabilities.

I am just some old dumb guy with no formal education.  Going on 78, one could say I know nothing. But then I love the idea of the Republic and speaking through me…so does my creator.  So on that basis here is the response I am directed to provide.

Resolution, statute or law makes no difference on the documentation of historical events, witnessed and recorded.  In this case it is not about creating a law…it was about doing what was right for humanity; the American people.  It is the fraud upon the American people which is the issue not the format on which the facts were recorded.

Further, also recorded was the reference to ten other southern states plus several northern states as well also in agreement.  And then there is the matter of the “full faith and credit clause…”  With so many independent observations all verifying the major details, these facts can not be simply dismissed so easily.

Remember Tom, I qualified…

“the answered provided would clearly indicate whether or not one was interested in solving the problem we as Americans face today or not.”

Warmest personal regards…

On Jan 12, 2015, at 12:45 AM, Tom wrote:



A resolution has zero legislative impact as this document from 1957 so aptly indicates. Georgia nor the other states mentioned, the last I looked, ever succeeded, revolted or left in any way the union of states. This was my initial point. All your work Arnie, over these five years regrettably seems to be for naught. Actually, you probably had many wonderful moments of interest but as for any application or impact in the world of IS verses the world of OUGHT, sorry, ain’t happening.


Now, back to answering my question – YOUR SOLUTION, please?

From: Arnie Rosner []

Sent: Monday, January 12, 2015 3:38 AM



Dear Tom,


Thank you for your kind response.  Permit me to respond by asking you to review just one item of documentation presented in 1957.  Your response as to the significance of this information would be most appreciated.


·  Certification Georgia State Archives
I have taken the liberty of including Mr. Carl Swenson of Henry County, Georgia, in this exchange.  Mr. Swensson was kind enough to secure and provided the authentication from the state archivists.

On Jan 11, 2015, at 11:55 PM, Tom wrote:
Howdy Arnie,


After almost 40 years of academic studies on these issues, having earned three degrees, taught at a graduate level and spoken on these subjects thousands of times I have learned to recognize “false premise” questions when I see them, such as the one you put forth. As I stated earlier, I do not see a fraud upon the people of the globe, as you mean it, therefore you question is actually meaningless. A better approach for you is to state what you think the solution to your “fraud” may be. So I ask you, what is the solution to the problem of the US government being a illegitimate entity?



From: Arnie Rosner []

Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2015 11:36 PM



Dear Tom,


Thank you for taking the time to consider what was offered.


After more than 5 years of dedicated research, 24/7 for the most part, I have distilled the questions and opinions to one point.  Do you wish to solve the problem of the fraud upon the people of the globe or not.
Thank you for your response.

On Jan 11, 2015, at 5:07 AM, Tom wrote:
Ah, Arnie, at best you highlight the classic philosophical problem of the IS versus the OUGHT.


Let’s grant the total factual validity of your argument, which I don’t but for this point, I will.




Now, to the IS v. the OUGHT.  In life many people want to focus on how the world OUGHT to be (which in some cases – pro-life, is good). But many OUGHT folks (you) spend a life time chasing windmills and lose the opportunity to impact the world as it IS! I choose to spend my brief time on this earth dealing with the IS, the fact that 330 million people in America function, everyday, as if there IS a legitimate government. And so do you. If someone robs your house or knocks you over the head, you call the government to help you, the police, thus you live in the IS world but you want to live in the OUGHT world.  Fine, have at it, but realize it’s a fool’s errand, unless you plan to live to 300 years old and have the possible time to reconstitute America.


Have a wonderful weekend and don’t forget to thank your local government for the electricity that you are using to read this email!



From: Arnie Rosner []

Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 4:10 PM
To: Tom

Mr. Tom,


Thank you for your sincere efforts to alert the world to the dangers of Islam.  I really appreciate what you do, but…as tempting as it may be…we must resist taking the bait and look further to the real threat.


Until you also expose the massive fraud behind the usurpation of all lawful government, at the federal level, the state level, the county level and the city level, that would be all lawful government, based upon the true delegated authority of the people being governed, your words can not possibly be placed into the proper perspective.


Please consider the following:

Rod Class Exposes State Governments are franchise branches of federal corporation posing as government of the American People.
And even during Lincoln’s time the people were exploited by unscrupulous members of the Congress.  And as late as 1957 the state of Georgia and 10 other states made exception.  And even then, good knowledgable people like you chose to ignore these charges as you will probably attempt to do today.

However, sir…I urge you to resist the temptation to dismiss this information for the members of government to whom you make your appeals are not the members of the government you believe them to be.  And Tom…you are far too intelligent to get away with such shoddy illogical thinking.


You of all people know better!


Georgia, the Lawful State: MEMORIAL TO CONGRESS — 14th and 15th AMENDMENTS DECLARED VOID

The American people have had no lawful government since about 1862.  The current system of de facto government was imposed through the manipulations of foreign sympathizers of the British Crown under the administration of FDR.







About arnierosner

As an American I advocate a republic form of government, self-reliance, and adherence to the basic philosophy of the founding fathers and the founding documents, I ONLY respect those who respect and "HONOR" their honor. No exceptions!
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